New Zealand National Anthem

[Deleted]

One thing I like about the NZ National Anthem is that it is really a prayer to God.

I wonder if KTJ ever sings [prays] it?

[KTJ]

Nov 18, 2014 23:09:09 GMT 10 @muslimmatt said:

One thing I like about the NZ National Anthem is that it is really a prayer to God.

There is NO god, so how can a national anthem be a prayer to something which doesn't even exist except in the minds of feeble people?

Get over yourself, Matty-boy, you are an idiot and a simpleton.

Give it time, and those of us NZers who are intelligent will get that anthem changed, hopefully at the same time as we get rid of that old german woman and replace her with an elected president.

[pim]

So ... you don't like your country's anthem? Most people find their country's anthem to be a tad dreary. I've only heard the NZ anthem at international rugby matches involving the All Blacks. From what I could see the Kiwis in the crowd would join in with enthusiasm and gusto. Whereas the Australians would mumble their way through Advance Australia Fair in a desultory way because:

a) they don't really know the words, and

b) as a piece of music it sucks only slightly less than that US dirge The Star Spangled Banner which from a musical point of view is appalling and the words are impossible. By contrast the Netherlands national anthem, the Wilhelmus, while it's full of references to the Dutch monarchy and its leading role in forging the Dutch nation in the struggle against the Hapsburgs some 500 years ago, also happens to be a bloody good song and, providing you know the Dutch language, is very "sing-a-longable".


The problem, though with choosing a good song to be the national anthem is that invariably it kills the song. Which is why I'm glad that Waltzing Matilda has never become the Australian national anthem and I'll settle for the dirge we're saddled with.

Don't be boring, KTJ, yourcountry's anthem is OK. At least when I see the enthusiasm and enjoyment of the Kiwi crowd as they sing it before the All Blacks perform their haka, you kinda get the idea that these people are really behind their team.

[KTJ]

I do know the words to NZ's national anthem, in both Maori and English.

It is traditional to sing the first verse in Maori, followed by the first verse in English.

However, there are several other verses and I know those in both languages too.

And....I also know the words to the Australian national anthem. We sing it in NZ on Anzac Day, followed by our own national anthem.

[Deleted]

The Australian National Anthem doesn't mention God, which is appalling.

[KTJ]

Nov 21, 2014 23:24:36 GMT 10 @muslimmatt said:

The Australian National Anthem doesn't mention God, which is appalling.

There is nothing at all appalling about failing to mention something which is but a mere figment of imagination in the minds of weak individuals who need a religious crutch rather than standing on their own two feet.

It IS after all now the 21st century (and has been so for fourteen years), not the dark ages.......faaaaaaaaark!!!

[KTJ]

Here is the complete NZ National Anthem, all five verses....

E Ihowā Atua,
O ngā iwi mātou rā
Āta whakarangona;
Me aroha noa
Kia hua ko te pai;
Kia tau tō atawhai;
Manaakitia mai
Aotearoa

Ōna mano tāngata
Kiri whero, kiri mā,
Iwi Māori, Pākehā,
Rūpeke katoa,
Nei ka tono ko ngā hē
Māu e whakaahu kē,
Kia ora mārire
Aotearoa

Tōna mana kia tū!
Tōna kaha kia ū;
Tōna rongo hei pakū
Ki te ao katoa
Aua rawa ngā whawhai
Ngā tutū e tata mai;
Kia tupu nui ai
Aotearoa

Waiho tona takiwā
Ko te ao mārama;
Kia whiti tōna rā
Taiāwhio noa.
Ko te hae me te ngangau
Meinga kia kore kau;
Waiho i te rongo mau
Aotearoa

Tōna pai me toitū
Tika rawa, pono pū;
Tōna noho, tāna tū;
Iwi nō Ihowā.
Kaua mōna whakamā;
Kia hau te ingoa;
Kia tū hei tauira;
Aotearoa

Note that this is not a direct translation from English to Māori — the Māori version basically says the same thing, but in a different way (and the differences are considerable). A direct translation from Māori to English of the first verse only (as an example), line by line, results in this....

O Lord, God,
of all people
Listen to us,
Cherish us
May good flourish,
May your blessings flow.
Defend
Aotearoa

Now, you can compare that to the first verse (literally, line by line) of the English version, as shown below.



The complete English version of the NZ National Anthem is as follows....

God of Nations at Thy feet,
In the bonds of love we meet,
Hear our voices, we entreat,
God defend our free land.
Guard Pacific's triple star
From the shafts of strife and war,
Make her praises heard afar,
God defend New Zealand.

Men of every creed and race,
Gather here before Thy face,
Asking Thee to bless this place,
God defend our free land.
From dissension, envy, hate,
And corruption guard our state,
Make our country good and great,
God defend New Zealand.

Peace, not war, shall be our boast,
But, should foes assail our coast,
Make us then a mighty host,
God defend our free land.
Lord of battles in Thy might,
Put our enemies to flight,
Let our cause be just and right,
God defend New Zealand.

Let our love for Thee increase,
May Thy blessings never cease,
Give us plenty, give us peace,
God defend our free land.
From dishonour and from shame,
Guard our country's spotless name,
Crown her with immortal fame,
God defend New Zealand.

May our mountains ever be
Freedom's ramparts on the sea,
Make us faithful unto Thee,
God defend our free land.
Guide her in the nations' van,
Preaching love and truth to man,
Working out Thy glorious plan,
God defend New Zealand.


Now as you can see, there is waaaaaay too much “god bullshit” in there, although perhaps Matty-boy would be happier if that “god” word was replaced with “allah”. However, that would merely perpetuate the delusional bent to our NZ National Anthem. What it really needs is a complete rewrite to get rid of the dark-ages crap altogether. There is nothing wrong with the basic sentiment of the anthem, it's just all that delusional god stuff that spoils it. Unfortunately, the current government would be too gutless to mess with it. But who knows, perhaps a future more enlightened government in NZ may see fit to tidy up our national anthem? I certainly hope so, although I'm not holding my breath waiting.

[pim]

This has been a serious contender for selection as the Italian national anthem. It's the Chorus of the Hebrew Slaves in the opera "Nabucco" and was composed by Verdi. Patriotic Italians love Verdi and he is to Italian opera what Shakespeare is to English theatre. Verdi's operas encompass the theme of the Italian struggle against both the Pope and the Austrian Hapsburgs for nationhood, so even though he set his operas in Ancient Egypt (as in Aïda) and in Old Testament Israel (as in Nabucco which is really Italian for "Nebuchadnezzar", the Babylonian King who exiled the Hebrews "by the waters of Babylon" which gives rise to the story of Daniel), his operas are allegories for the plight of 19th century Italians languishing under foreign oppression.

“Va pensiero” in original Italian

Va', pensiero, sull'ali dorate;
Va, ti posa sui clivi, sui colli,
ove olezzano tepide e molli
l'aure dolci del suolo natal!
Del Giordano le rive saluta,
di Sionne le torri atterrate…
Oh mia Patria sì bella e perduta!
O membranza sì cara e fatal!
Arpa d'or dei fatidici vati,
perché muta dal salice pendi?
Le memorie nel petto raccendi,
ci favella del tempo che fu!
O simile di Solima ai fati,
traggi un suono di crudo lamento;
o t'ispiri il Signore un concento
che ne infonda al patire virtù!

“Va pensiero” English translation

Hasten thoughts on golden wings.
Hasten and rest on the densely wooded hills,
where warm and fragrant and soft
are the gentle breezes of our native land!
The banks of the Jordan we greet
and the towers of Zion.
O, my homeland, so beautiful and lost!
O memories, so dear and yet so deadly!
Golden harp of our prophets,
why do you hang silently on the willow?
Rekindle the memories of our hearts,
and speak of the times gone by!
Or, like the fateful Solomon,
draw a lament of raw sound;
or permit the Lord to inspire us
to endure our suffering!

You don't really need to know word for word what it means. The stirring music is sufficient to quicken the blood. It's the best anthem that Italy never had which makes me glad they never adopted it as their anthem. Otherwise it would have been a good song ruined.

[KTJ]

I prefer Wagner to Verdi.

Verdi is okay, but it is somewhat frothy & lightweight compared to the complexity and intensity of Wagner.

[Deleted]

Imagine if this was the national anthem. I would love it:

[Deleted]

This should be the New Zealand National Anthem:

[pim]

I agree about Wagner. Those old German legends have a "Lord of the Rings" quality to them and in fact there's a lot of the Nibelungen Ring Cycle in the Lord of the Rings. But Wagner's music has never been sugggested as a national anthem. Verdi's has.

What Wagner's music has given us is the great wedding march in "Lohengrin"

[KTJ]

Germany could always consider adopting a particular well-known piece of music from “Die Walküre” as their national anthem (with suitable words)....

I'm sure you would know which particular piece of music I am talking about (although a dumbarse like Matty-boy wouldn't have a clue, because his cultural mental capacity is severely lacking/retarded due to his stained-glass-mind religiousosity).


Anyway, one of my favourite pieces of music from Wagner is from Act 2 of “Tristan und Isolde”....



....I attended a performance of that epic opera in Auckland earlier this year. What a buzz!!

[KTJ]

from The Dominion Post....

Hear our anthem, we entreat

By TOM HUNT | 9:50AM - Saturday, 22 November 2014


WINNERS: The triumphant New Zealand rowing eight salute with clasped hands after their victory
at Munich. They shed tears of joy as their gold medals hung on their chests and the band played
“God Defend New Zealand”. From left they are: Robertson, Coker, Earl, Wilson, Hunter,
Joyce, Veldman, Hurt and Dickie.

THEY stood on the dais, hands raised in the air. Some had tears in their eyes.

The New Zealand rowing eight had made history on two fronts in Munich in 1972 — they had won Olympic gold and, as popular myth goes, for the first time ever, “God Defend New Zealand” was played to mark the occasion.

In fact, Yvette Williams is understood to have had both God Save the Queen and God Defend New Zealand played when she won gold at the Helsinki Olympics in 1952.

The anthem had long been our official song. But ever since New Zealand became a colony, we had sung God Save the Queen at official functions. Most notable of those were when New Zealand won at the Olympics, Te Ara senior editor Nancy Swarbrick says.

Peter Snell's golds at Tokyo in 1964 and Jack Lovelock's gold in Berlin in 1936 were among those marked by an anthem asking for a deity many of us didn't believe in to save a monarch on the other side of the world.

It was officially November 21st, 1977 — 37 years ago this week — when Internal Affairs Minister Allan Highet announced the national anthems of New Zealand would be God Save the Queen and God Defend New Zealand. They would have equal status and be sung as the occasion deemed appropriate.

Highet said the Queen had agreed to recognise God Defend New Zealand but it would be “more appropriate” to sing God Save the Queen when she, a member of her family, or the governor-general was present.

God Defend New Zealand was fine “whenever the national identity of New Zealand is to be emphasised, even when it is associated with a toast to her”.

The Queen's approval was crucial — the right to declare a song a national anthem rested with the sovereign, Swarbrick says.

Highet also said the anthem had been translated into Maori and hoped “it will soon be heard as often in Maori as in English”.

But in many ways the New Zealand public had already decided.

A survey in 1973 found 47 percent of respondents wanted God Defend New Zealand, to 32 percent who didn't.

Meanwhile, just 19 percent wanted to change the flag, compared with 75 percent who didn't.

An Evening Post editorial of 1973 said “nothing would be more idiotic than to press for the replacement of God Save the Queen by that mournful dirge God Defend New Zealand”.

On the anthem and flag debates, it warned that “if officialdom rushes in and discards them in a hurry they might be replaced by a design, and words and tune, that will make our people shudder”.

There were few shudders, though, when the rowing eight, having just nailed one of New Zealand's greatest sporting achievements, stood on the dais in Munich as God Defend New Zealand — despite not yet being the official anthem — marked the occasion.

“It is a bit of a mystery why God Defend New Zealand was played at the Olympics,” Swarbrick says.

Whatever the case, it was perhaps the uplifting moment that was needed to get the new anthem recognised.

The anthem was written by Irish poet and journalist Thomas Bracken and published in Dunedin's Saturday Advertiser — which he edited at the time — in 1876.

But it was in the 1930s, amid a rise of nationalism, that the movement to turn it into our anthem began. In 1938, the National Centennial Council made it our national song, a title it retained for almost four decades.

But even in the 1970s there was little political appetite for the change.

In 1973, Prime Minister Norman Kirk felt no great pressure to “rush into” it and in 1977 Prime Minister Rob Muldoon felt no compelling urge to ditch God Save the Queen.

In 1974, John Rowles offered to pen a new part-Maori, part-English anthem.

There was a lot of debate. Self-proclaimed agnostic J. Sellen wrote a letter to the editor saying he did not care what the anthem was, but “don't ask God to save you, as if you were a lot of beautiful saints”.

“With the crime rate here, covering murder, rape, drugs and suicide ... I don't see much of God's country here.”

With relatively little fanfare, 37 years ago we officially adopted God Defend New Zealand.

Meanwhile, the flag debate bubbles on.

www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/63440238/Hear-our-anthem-we-entreat

[pim]

The Kiwis were right, back in 1901, to say "No thanks" to becoming a State in the newly-minted Commonwealth of Australia even though New Zealand is written into the Preamble as a foundation State. It had that option but chose, wisely in my view, not to take it up and to go it alone. But it's always had a close relationship with the British Crown - possibly due to the fact that its foundation document, the Treaty of Waitangi, is with the British Crown. If NZ were to become a republic in the South Pacific they would probably first have to sort out the land question in which the Maoris agreed to accept the British Monarch as their Sovereign. Change that and you change the land question. If I were Maori I might be a strong supporter of the Monarchy for that reason. Same with the Canadians, the treaties with the First Nations were between them and the British Crown. Break the connecttion with the Crown by becoming a republic and you change the "land" equation. So it may come as a surprise to learn that some of the strongest supporters of the monarchy within the New World "dominions" are to be found among the indigenous inhabitants.

This is not to say that a republic will never happen. It might, but then again it might not. There's nothing "inevitable" about a republic in NZ, or Canada or Australia. As an institution what is remarkable about monarchy is its tenacity. People like having a King or Queen. And in countries like France or the US which became republics, that happened because it was the only option they had left ... but when you read the French popular press and see the tabloid fascination they've always had with royalty, and likewise in the US where American VIPs absolutely love to be seen hobnobbing with British royalty, you get the feeling that they're a bit jealous of the British and wish that they hadn't cut the ties a couple of centuries ago in the case of the Americans, or cut their King's head off in the case of the French.